Interview with Jinkang Wang1

Bing Liu

Shandong University of Traditional Chinese Medicine;Center for Science Communication and Popularization of CAST-Tsinghua University,China

Jinkang Wang

China Science Writers Association,China

Liu:Professor Wang,I am very happy to have this opportunity to talk with you.I will try to avoid asking questions you have probably answered a thousand times,but please forgive me if there are still some familiar questions.In many interviews,you mentioned that the reason you got into writing science fiction was because you wanted to tell stories to your son.Let’s put it another way.We can see that many important science-fiction writers—like you and Liu Cixin—started writing science fiction as part-time work in smaller cities.What does this experience mean for your science-fiction career?

Wang:Based on my experience,a science-fiction writer probably needs the following qualities (of course,these are not all of them,but they are among the most important).First,the author should be sensitive to the power of science and the mechanisms of nature,free in their thinking and full of imagination.Second,they must be ‘immersed’ in the high-tech environment,with easy access to large amounts of information.Third,the author needs to be well versed in literature.

Living in a small city has both advantages and disadvantages for writing science fiction.Specifically,there is a disadvantage with respect to the second quality I mentioned just now,and,basically,there is no impact on the third quality.However,when it comes to the first quality,living in such an environment can be an advantage.Because there are fewer temptations in society in smaller cities,the author’s mind is calm and peaceful.They will have a leisurely mood,allowing them to look up to the starry sky and appreciate the mysteries of the universe.My job as an engineer also has both pros and cons for my writing career.The quick mind and rigorous logic I developed through my years of work are beneficial for my science-fiction writing because clear scientific rationality is the foundation of science fiction.Of course,because I was writing part time,the amount of time I could spend on writing was rather limited.But time is like water in a sponge.People who are really committed can always squeeze out a little bit of water,and this is especially true for authors of short science-fiction stories.For long stories,the problem with time becomes more difficult to solve.As for myself,most of my long stories were written after I received approval for early retirement at the age of 50.

Liu:Regarding your works,I only started to pay attention to them at the later stage of your career.I like reading your novels very much,and I have discussed several of your long novels with my friends.In my opinion,there are two prominent and general themes running through your works—one is about life science and ethics,and the other involves the more grandiose and ultimate cosmic issues.How did you choose these two themes for your creations? Is there any connection between them?

Wang:Thanks for your appreciation of my writing.As I said just now,writing science fiction requires a sensitive mind.In fact,this is also true for reading science fiction.Science fiction is a hybrid of science and literature.Standing on the shoulders of the giants of science,science fiction is able to leap beyond humanity itself and across time and space to see the world with ‘God’s eyes’.Until now,science has mingled deeply with the humanities,and it might even be said that science can provide more profound answers to the ultimate questions in the field of the humanities,such as:What is humanity?What is human nature?Where did human beings come from? Where are they headed?

In my mind,‘nature and man have always been united’.Humans come from nature and are part of nature.When writing about human nature on the surface,I also keep an eye on its deeper part —its biological and physical essence.When shaping an individual character,I will not forget that he or she belongs to the biological group of humans,which makes him or her part of the predestined cycle of‘biological evolution’.For example,in my novelThe Song of Life,I wrote about the love–hate relationship between a father and his robot son,but,at a deeper level,I was thinking about the human desire for survival or the meaning of survival itself.Another book,Challenge of Medusa,looks like a story about a father and his rebellious son,but is,in reality,about a vision—how to preserve the fruits of civilization,or at least its imprints,beyond the destination of the universe.Therefore,in my mind,bioethics and cosmic issues are naturally inseparable.

Liu:You have joined the debate over the definition of science fiction many times,and you seem to prefer the concept of ‘core science fiction’ and to think it can reflect the nature of things better than the old concepts of ‘hard science fiction’ and‘soft science fiction’.Can you give us some explanations,maybe with examples from your own novels?Also,you often refer to the concept of ‘big science fiction’ and seem to think that it’s hard to strictly define what science fiction is.This is similar to the debate about what science is,which is still waiting for a final conclusion.If we go the opposite way and reframe the question as ‘What is not science fiction?’,is it possible to draw a boundary around science fiction?

Wang:I have always supported the notion of‘big science fiction’.Any novel can be classified as science fiction as long as it has a science-fiction element.This would be more conducive to the development of the science-fiction ecosystem.Of course,science fiction—just like everything else—must have a core.Science-fiction novels that are ‘most science-fiction-like’ are more closely integrated with science and technology and can thus better capitalize on the unique strengths of science fiction;they are immersed in scientific rationality and often utilize a unique literary technique — a science-fiction framework(a story setting based on scientific knowledge and rationality that serves as an intrinsic driver for the unfolding of the plot).There is no hierarchical division between core science fiction and non-core science fiction,and it is often the latter that has a larger audience and more classic works.That said,for science fiction as a whole,core science fiction must be the backbone,or else this literary genre would lose its reason for existing.The term ‘core science fiction’ is similar to the term ‘hard science fiction’ that was used in the past,but it is not very accurate to mention soft science fiction and hard science fiction in the same breath.It is just like saying,‘There are two main types of celestial bodies in the solar system:stars and planets.’Is this statement correct?Of course it is correct.But it does not faithfully describe the relationship between stars and planets,because it fails to express the important information that‘the stars are the core of the celestial system’.

As for‘What is not science fiction?’,the answer is easier.Journey to the Westis obviously not science fiction.While it is also inspired by a wild imagination,such an imagination is not scientifically rational and is unrelated to science.Carpenter Made Man,on the other hand,can be categorized as science fiction.Although its depiction of technology is not concerned with science and technology at all,its core concept—that humans can be composed of inanimate matter—is in line with scientific rationality.

Liu:In fact,one of the reasons I like your science fiction the most is because I see in it the conflict between science and the humanities,especially conflict in the moral sense,and it also comes with profound and critical questioning.However,you have always been emphasizing your firm belief in science.You have said that in your work,introspection,reflection and critique regarding science take up a large proportion,but in the end,these critiques are built on a faith in science,and you are doing this only because you care about it.Even so,as I see it,your reflection on the possible consequences of scientific progress and your deep faith in science still seem to be somewhat contradictory.Can you shed some light on this?

Wang:Of course there is a contradiction between the two,and it is a deep,internal and irreconcilable contradiction,but this is precisely how nature works.I have said similar things many times in my works.For example,I said,‘Science has helped humans find the road to the Kingdom of Freedom,a road that is flat and solid,paved with granite.Brush away the dust on the road and you can see God’s decree: Follow this road to the Kingdom of Freedom,and don’t take a single step beyond it.Is this the freedom we seek? What a big joke it is!’ I also said,‘science has turned humans into giants,but it has also mercilessly deconstructed humanity’s reverence and sense of mystery for their own lives,which is in fact the basis of all human laws and moral ethics’.

Science has always been a double-edged sword,not in the utilitarian but in the philosophical sense.Science has enabled humans to lead prosperous lives,bring nature to its knees and move towards the Kingdom of Freedom,but it has also revealed that human civilization and everything in the universe will eventually perish,so it has somehow resurrected fatalism.Science has helped humans overcome different kinds of genetic diseases and epidemics,but it has also resulted in the dangerous accumulation of undesirable genes in human communities and the rapid evolution of pathogens,and such a contradiction can never be resolved.Science has produced exceptionally powerful artificial intelligence,so powerful that many leading scientists are worried that it will soon beat humans,but they are unable to do anything about it or reverse this historical trend.Despite all these‘shadows’of science,it is science itself,not religion and not even philosophy,that makes us see the limitations of science.Therefore,paradoxes exist everywhere and at all times,and it is only normal for us to be selfcontradictory in our understanding of science and our feelings about it.

Liu:In your works,the concept of‘God’is often present,either directly or implicitly.Although you have explained your understanding of God in different places,even in your novels,can you give us a more unified and complete summary of your view here?

Wang:The God in my works is,of course,a God in an objective sense,not a personified mortal God.He only issues laws and has no active intelligence.He only observes on the sidelines and never participates.But perhaps our understanding of ‘intelligence’ was too narrowly scoped in the past,so we may as well think the other way.Where do human intelligence,consciousness and mobility come from?Ultimately,they come from the complex bonding of billions of ordinary atoms,and when that bonding is complex enough,it gives rise to something higher,and there is no supernatural force in it that is uniquely human.If we can put aside our deep-rooted human narcissism,we will be able to look at other ‘intelligences’ with a more peaceful mind.We know that biological evolution is a result of random mutations,and that it is essentially a trial-and-error process,which,of course,is not intelligence.But,in the course of unconscious evolution,eagles have got sharper eyes,cheetahs are running faster,and humans are also getting smarter.Then,if we condense such a long geological period into one hundred years,you will see that there seems to be a wise and dedicated God of evolution who is actively arranging all of these things,and the unconscious,random evolution in a condensed time frame is equivalent to intelligence,which is just like the ‘complex bonding that turns ordinary atoms into intelligence’.As a matter of fact,even the evolution of the whole universe is like this.The evolution of the universe strictly follows the laws of simplicity,beauty and universality,which are innate and eternal,but this unconscious evolution,when condensed in time,seems to be governed by a mighty and dedicated God.I once said:followers of religion believe that God created man,but this is not really reverence,because if God has divine power,of course he can create man.On the contrary,believers in science know that God is not actually intervening but watching ‘matter’ do the trick itself (i.e.,self-organization in the concept of physics).Through countless low-level combinations,transitions,failures,detours and extinctions,a colourful biological world,including intelligent and brilliant humans,has banged into existence.It is only by understanding this process that one can genuinely revere the mighty force of nature (God).Therefore,although I am an absolute atheist,I also hold a deep reverence for nature.I would rather say that when I write science-fiction novels,there is always a mighty,wise and calm God high above my head,and whether he is a personified God or an objective God is only a matter of secondary importance.

Liu:Like other types of literary creation,sciencefiction writing would seem to be a very personal activity.After decades of science-fiction writing,you must have accumulated a great deal of experience and developed a unique perspective on and understanding of how science fiction is created.Put briefly,what would you say are your personal experiences and reflections?And which of these experiences and reflections do you think would be difficult for younger science-fiction writers to appreciate?Why?

Wang:Always keep your passion for writing and life and stay sensitive and sharp-minded;write about what you know best and what resonates with you most,at least while you’re still learning to write;and keep writing.All of these experiences should be easy for our young writers to take in.What they lack is accumulation,including accumulation of life experience and accumulation of ideas.

Liu:In recent years,science fiction has grown more and more popular in China.But,despite the public fanfare,it seems that only a few top writers like you and Liu Cixin can write top-class science-fiction novels.What do you think of this?Given the real situation we see,is this fanfare around science fiction‘overblown’,and how long do you think it will last?

Wang:Science fiction is unlike other types of literature.The latter may not develop at the same pace as a country’s economic strength or national power.As people often say,‘classics come out of times of chaos’,and ‘poets are fortunate when the country is in misfortune’.Science fiction is the only kind of literature that is strongly tied to national power or technological advances because both science-fiction authors and readers need to acquire a certain level of knowledge,and only when society develops technologically and economically can there be a group of such authors and,most importantly,a large enough market of readers.Therefore,as long as China’s economic growth continues and the country’s rise is not interrupted,science fiction will continue to develop,and its popularity will be sustained.Many talented young science-fiction writers have already grown up in China.They are quick-minded,with access to information and an international perspective,all of which are advantages that I do not have.Their mastery of literature may also have exceeded that of our generation,because we experienced a period of literary malnutrition while we were growing up.It is only a matter of time before some of them reach the same level as me and even surpass me.What they lack is time,accumulation and a peaceful mind.Literary creation,including science fiction,requires a lifetime of inner peace,but,compared to our times,there are far more temptations outside of literature in today’s world.In this sense,it may be harder for the younger generation to succeed than it was for us.

Declaration of conflicting interests

The authors declared no potential conflicts of interest with respect to the research,authorship,and/or publication of this article.

Funding

The authors received no financial support for the research,authorship,and/or publication of this article.

Note

1.This article was first published in the first issue ofNovel Reviewin 2021.